TECHNICAL FORUMS => Project Builds => Topic started by: xjh3 on November 28, 2010, 06:57:30 PM
Title: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on November 28, 2010, 06:57:30 PM
Hello all,
After Rausch giving me a good idea of what I need to do to my Jeep to get it to do what I want it to, my head is spinning a little with all the options.
I\'m starting with a 97 auto, D30/8.25 both 3.55 and open, 4.5\" lift, and 32\" BFG MTs. I\'d like to move on to 35\'s and a mid or long arm setup in the front.
My biggest limitation is that I don\'t have a good working space or much money. I either own or have access to all the tools I\'ll need, and have the mechanical and fab skills to do almost everything. This leads my mind to wander on to all the possibilities, but everything has to be done in my driveway on jackstands. Hence, I have been focused more on short term, attainable projects to keep me wheeling for the time being like a rear disc swap, Aussies, etc. until I can figure out a better working space of my own. However, I don\'t want to dump too much money into something I should really be looking to upgrade altogether but I don\'t want to get over my head into something in my driveway either.
D44\'s, 8.8s, Super 30 kits... I guess I\'m mostly looking for someone who\'s done this all before to guide me to a good starting point to get to where I want to be, even if it means just staying where I\'m at for a while I guess.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on November 29, 2010, 04:27:30 PM
Anything you can do in a proper shop with a hoist can be done with jackstands and determination :)
keep the 30 and drive gently. put cromos in it if you start breaking frequently. A 44 is a fine axle in whatever it came in, it is NEVER worth swapping into something else IMO. Same ujoints as the newer 30, and older 30s can get big joint shafts.
8.8 rear is a good swap but the 8.25 will be fine, they\'re every bit as strong as a 44.
lock it up and enjoy for now. Long arm lift would be my next step, personally. then probably some rocker guards and gearing.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on November 29, 2010, 04:34:11 PM
dont forget a healthy trans cooler for that auto. Larger tires and lift usually precede the corrective gearing changes, making the trans work much harder.
id suggest first getting a pair of aussies from Bill for it, then grow into the 35\"s later. Alot of the TJ\'s and ZJ\'s here make the big joint 30\'s last a while with locked 35\"s.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: CoraC143 on November 29, 2010, 04:40:52 PM
Joints are very important, all of my front axle (dana 44) breaks were due to u-joint failures.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on November 29, 2010, 04:46:22 PM
chromo shafts, spicer joints- thats expected.
throw in knobby 36\'s, a t18 and a V8, thats inevitable.
My weak link on the CJ with a chromo 30 was warn hubs. once i welded up a set into drive flanges, I then broke two ring gears.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on November 29, 2010, 08:11:24 PM
Mr. Mindless, I have done everything up to this point on jackstands in my gravel driveway. My neighbors think I\'m crazy, I also prefer \'determined\'. But when time and money are short, I could easily see a summer build project quickly end up sitting in the snow not having been wheeled in months.
I think I will stick with locking front/rear and running it the way it is until I\'m ready for 35\"s and 4.88s. I\'m glad to hear D30/35\"s success stories. I also want to build my own long-arm front suspension setup this coming summer. New rhinolined floors and square tube rocker replacements are on the never ending list as well...
Smike, I\'m still learning names... Who is Bill? I meant to ask if there were any club connections to Aussie. I am on the waiting list for an 8.25 locker and was planning to order a front one soon as well.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: ollllllo on November 29, 2010, 08:34:04 PM
\"Bill\" is Bill Cole Owner of Aussie Locker
He is a Rochester resident and Fingerlakes 4x4 Club member for many years.
I agree with both Mindless and Smike.
Before buying a lift I did everything on Jackstands. And for building a suspension system from scratch, I set the chassis at ride height with jackstands and build from there.
Dont waste your money on swapping in an axle which is only moderately stronger than the 30. (TRUST US, MOST OF US LEARNED THIS THE HARD WAY)
IMO install a locker or two. The Aussie is a very easy install and can be done in a few hours.
Add some body protection and wheel it.
Your XJ has the ability to run pretty much anything we ran at Rausch Saturday. That confidence comes with more seat time.
Upgrade the 30 shafts if you need to, and more importantly as Smike pointed out...dont skimp on u-joints. A broken u-joint has the potential to destroy the ears of the shafts anyway.
I have run Alloy USA Chromoly shafts in my CJ DANA 30 for years now. I beat this axle pretty hard and when I finally did break a shaft, Quadratec warrantied it. They sent me a free replacement no questions asked, no shipping the broken shaft to the manufacturer. just a phone call.
ALLOY USA (http://www.quadratec.com/products/52400_503_07.htm)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 02, 2010, 10:34:19 PM
Ok ok, jackstands aren\'t that bad. Haha. I just don\'t wanna work in the snow!
I think I got a good plan though, thanks guys. My head has stopped spinning. ETA on the 8.25 locker is the end of January. AHH!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 05, 2010, 10:02:36 PM
What are everyone\'s feelings on wheel U-joints as far as greasable vs non-greasable? Seems like every time I replace them they are bone dry, so I always try to go greasable. I\'m planning to go Spicer per everyone\'s recommendations.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on December 06, 2010, 09:11:52 AM
If you keep up on them, greasable is the way to go.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on December 06, 2010, 09:51:33 AM
unless you\'ve made a habit of breaking them, greasable. that little hole in the middle isn\'t that much for strength anyway, and a dry joint will always get chewed up on a DD quickly.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: bear555 on December 08, 2010, 03:24:42 PM
There are allot of XJs in the club now, a little bit longer and we\'ll give the TJs a run for the money. The first thing you should get is a real pair of front tow hooks in the front if you don\'t have them already. They are kind of a pain to install but your uni-body will thank you.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 16, 2010, 09:44:16 PM
bear555, I have front and rear bumpers tied into the unibody using many more bolts that the stock mounting points.
There is a Ford 8.8 already set up for XJ with discs and a heavy duty diff cover that even matches my current gearing that I think I can get for $150. Catch is, the spiders are welded. What are everyone\'s thoughts on that? I do not daily drive my Jeep. If I get it and hate it, it seems like I could just pull the welded spiders and throw an Aussie in, right? (8.8 Aussies are in stock!!)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: luvmyxj on December 16, 2010, 10:20:42 PM
all set ready to go 8.8 for 150,id jump on that in a heartbeat.mikemike drives the dakota with a welded rear on the street with no problem i beleive
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on December 17, 2010, 08:57:15 AM
dont count on being able to cut and grind out welded spider gears if it was done right.
with that said, id jump on it too.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 17, 2010, 12:33:50 PM
I guess for that price I\'d be willing to chaulk it up to kinda of an experiment. I\'m sure I could sell it for about the same if it sucks.
My biggest concern is street driving obviously. It\'s not my DD, but I don\'t have a trailer so it has to get driven to trails (4.5 hrs to Rausch!)
Am I just kinda being a pussy? Haha
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: luvmyxj on December 17, 2010, 12:44:00 PM
pretty muck j/k, like i said mikemike drives the dak to and from rausch with a welded rear before his trailer
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on December 17, 2010, 03:17:33 PM
welded is fine on the street, and will be just the same as an aussie in the snow :)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 17, 2010, 10:19:22 PM
The guy wouldn\'t budge from $175, it\'s mine now though.
I\'ve got my Jeep up in our spare bay at my work to work on my list:
-Ditching control arm drop brackets for RE Superflex short arms I bought and rebuilt (not long arms yet, but I need the clearance for now)
-Square tube rocker panel replacements. They were just about rotted through anyway and Rausch finished them off.
-New front ball joints, wheel u-joints, and Aussie
-8.8 install :)
I\'m excited. I\'ll get pics up soon.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Nick on December 18, 2010, 04:18:00 PM
I have been running my ZJ on 35\'s locked front and rear for about 2 years now with great luck with the D30. As long as you are gentle and dont get to crazy with the throttle you will be fine. In my opinion the jump from 33\'s to 35\'s is a relativly big jump in regards to modification. The stuff that should be changed is your gearing should be a min of 4.10 you will need upgraded steering all spare axle parts and the list goes on. With 33\'s you can kinda skirt by on mostly stock parts but once you are on 35\'s it really starts adding up in what you have to change.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: ollllllo on December 19, 2010, 10:16:43 AM
good deal on the 8.8 keep us updated!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Spencer on December 19, 2010, 07:24:25 PM
Picked up his 8.8 yesterday. thought you guys would like to see it. that thing is BEEF!!
Trying to upload the pic but it says \"Protector detects attacking action\". must be doing something wrong
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: luvmyxj on December 19, 2010, 09:36:18 PM
thats a screaming deal for a bolt in 8.8, youd pay 125 -150 just for the axle at a jy, that ujoint adapter on the pinion is a $30 part itself, is that a riddler cover or just a stock cover painted green?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 19, 2010, 10:25:11 PM
The guy told me it was a Ruff Stuff cover! $130 new. I\'m glad you guys talked me into it, the more time goes on, the more I realize how much I lucked out!!
I worked all day today. Got the control arm drop brackets out, had to go get new bolts, then fought to get all the arms back in. I got 3 in pretty quick, but couldn\'t get the last upper. Probably should have left the lowers for last. I was tired and without food so I called it a night.
I have sort of a question for NY unibody Jeep people. Every time I get underneath my Jeep it seems like I notice something else that looks like its about to rot through. I replaced a section of the unibody rail this summer where it was rotted by where the hitch was mounted and need to do the floors in the spring. I cut out my rockers and found some nice burrowing rust in front of the back wheel, kinda in the vicinity of the front leaf spring mount. Short of cutting it out and replacing it, (which given the junction of pinch seams, floor board and suspension mount would be daunting at best) what can be done? wire wheel and self etching primer? I\'m concerned, but I feel like half my Jeep could use getting cut out and replaced!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: ollllllo on December 20, 2010, 01:22:29 PM
I have learned that when you receive that error message, try changing the file name.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on December 21, 2010, 01:17:18 PM
The file name is exactly it. Avoid any special characters at all, I think even hyphens make it angry.
rot is a way of life here. I usually close my eyes and pretend it\'s fine :(
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 23, 2010, 10:08:00 PM
Got some stuff done this week.
RE Suplerflex arms are in.
While I had the front suspension apart, I remembered that my trackbar mount kinda sucked. I had a Teraflex trackbar that had the ball joint on the frame end. Earlier this fall I cut it off and welded in a Ballistic Fab joint and modified the stock bracket for double shear. It only kinda lined up right and worked OK. I decided I would just put the mount over the axle (where it should be anyway). I shortened the other end of the trackbar. I found that 1 1/2\" sched 80 had the perfect ID for the poly axle end bushing to go in and used that. I wasn\'t planning on doing this at all but it was easy and I\'m glad I did it. I had a small but noticeable amount of bumpsteer and it looks to me like this should come pretty close to eliminating it.
Spencer dropped off my 8.8 today. Super excited.
The tube for my rocker panels showed up yesterday, I\'m hoping to work on that Sunday maybe.
Ball joints, u-joints, and Aussie should be in next week.
Good thing I\'ve had a bunch of overtime this month!!!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 26, 2010, 09:35:12 AM
I just realized there was a dedicated \'Project Builds\' thread... Smike or Mindless, feel free to move this.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Nick on December 26, 2010, 01:32:18 PM
That is a score on the axle.
You should be careful with moving the tracbar mounts around with stock steering. If you get the tracbar and drag link out of parallel you will get death wobble. So if you have it all together and randomly now you have it, it is most likely that.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 26, 2010, 06:01:32 PM
Never had any death wobble ever, but I did have some noticeable bump steer. I took some measurements from the starting and ending points of the steering and trackbar and compared the slopes and they should be closer to parallel now than they were with the trackbar in the stock location.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 26, 2010, 06:05:13 PM
Also, what should I do about the surface rust on the rotors? Think I need to get them turned?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on December 26, 2010, 07:39:53 PM
take a wire wheel to them if it really bothers you, otherwise ignore it.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on December 27, 2010, 03:44:39 PM
Quote
Nick wrote: That is a score on the axle.
You should be careful with moving the tracbar mounts around with stock steering. If you get the tracbar and drag link out of parallel you will get death wobble. So if you have it all together and randomly now you have it, it is most likely that.
Like he said, bump steer - not death wobble.
same slope AND same length are the critical items. otherwise it takes some trig to figure out where you need to be.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 27, 2010, 10:12:38 PM
Mine weren\'t the same length from the factory. I\'m hoping it will be a little better, if nothing else I got rid of the weak stock mount.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: 85jimmyguy on December 30, 2010, 11:52:24 AM
your 8.8 is alot prettier than mine...lol
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 30, 2010, 11:42:37 PM
Weston!! Get going already would ya??
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 02, 2011, 09:20:31 PM
Finished up the rocker sliders albeit a top coat of paint on the driver\'s side. I ran into some corrosion issues with the pinch seem I was planning to weld the tube to on the bottom. I ended up cutting it off and braking a 2\" x 3/16\" piece to weld in along where the pinch seam was. I found a few more places that I\'ll need to address when I do my floors this summer too.
Now that they\'re on, I think the 3\"x5\"x3/16\" tube may have been a little big. I wanted 3\" to meet the bottom of the pinch seam but the 5\" is a little wide. I researched and measured, but I didn\'t realize it until I got them on how far out they really were. Better than not enough I suppose. I decided to not include the front fender in this, mostly as an effort to keep my trimming options open down the road. I didn\'t think it would be much of a problem too often that close to the tire.
Since I am working in our storage bay at work, (we call it \'the annex\') I have welded everything so far with my 110V Lincoln wirefeed. The fluxcore burns pretty good into the 3/16\" and 1/4\". I ran solid wire on every seam that has sheetmetal. I got it used for $250 this summer and so far it\'s been great.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on January 02, 2011, 10:35:37 PM
I think the 5\" looks good, and I love the little dovetail at the front end.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on January 03, 2011, 08:26:27 AM
the 3\" does look a little thick, but i like it.
it was too cold this weekend to start on mine but im in the same place, with 14\' of 2x5 sitting in the shop waiting
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on January 03, 2011, 04:45:40 PM
Looks great, Harrison!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 09, 2011, 07:51:35 PM
After seeing some FL4x4 rigs today at Monster Jam I kinda caught a wave of motivation to get mine wheeling again... Just need more time!!!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on January 09, 2011, 09:23:37 PM
Glad we could share some motivation! And thanks again for your help.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 15, 2011, 10:07:28 AM
I rented the ball joint tool from Autozone and got the passenger\'s side done. One concern though, the new ball joints (Spicer) seemed to press in considerably easier than the old ones came out. Not loose or wobbly in the hole, but I expected them to kinda pop in the last little bit but they didn\'t. They are in all the way. Tightened up with the knuckle on and everything seems tight. Thoughts?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on January 15, 2011, 06:30:35 PM
no rust holding the new ones out like was holding the old ones in. unless they slid in really loosely it\'s probably nothing at all to worry about.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 15, 2011, 06:45:48 PM
Great! Thanks Mindless.
Front end is reassembled with Aussie minus calipers and diff cover. I didn\'t have two tires to do the lock/unlock test with so I used two friends and some pry bars on the wheel studs. I\'m guessing this isn\'t ideal but it gave me the idea that it would ratchet under the conditions in the manual. I watched it with the cover off and noticed that it looked like only the driver\'s side was ratcheting, while the teeth on the other side were staying engaged. Does it matter as long as it was ratcheting?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 17, 2011, 06:34:22 PM
Nevermind on the Aussie thing, I don\'t think I was looking when I switched sides.
Front end is complete minus wheels and gear oil.
8.8 is in. Need to fab new u-bolt plates though. I did notice while sliding the two axles around on the floor that the 8.8 is significantly heavier than the 8.25. Pinion angle looks almost perfect and driveshaft is still just the right length. Both things I was a little worried about. Need to sort out e-brake and hydraulic brake lines this week. Decided to replace my crusted rear steel line all the way back.
Hoping to test drive this coming weekend... Can\'t wait.
I\'ll take pics tomorrow, I was too tired today.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 19, 2011, 09:25:12 PM
Here are some more pics. Got the u-bolt plates fabbed up. I threw in some pics of the shear, brake, and ironworker (100 ton punch) I used at work to make the plates as well as many other things. Some big, old, cool stuff. The ironworker used to run off the leather belts in the old factories a hundred years ago. Now a 3 phase motor runs the leather belt that runs it. Haha
All I need to do at this point is get the brake lines in and she\'s ready to go. Should have it driving around this weekend.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 19, 2011, 09:28:58 PM
Also gotta paint the calipers black, not diggin the orange/green combo.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: jACeL86 on January 20, 2011, 08:32:01 AM
I thought you might be re-naming the project to some Halloween themed thing :-p
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 23, 2011, 09:21:31 PM
Drove it back home to Sodus tonight from Rochester. No wobbles, shakes, or anything. Ditching the drop brackets definitely affected the ride though. Aussie seemed to be locking up in the snow in the parking lot. The only time I even faintly noticed the welded rear on the road was making a u-turn.
Last night I broke the hood release cable. Fortunately, as the little handle broke off it still released the hood, and Autozone had one in stock. Both seemed like a miracle to me.
I think I need to bleed the brakes again, and I\'m probably going to re-adjust my trackbar but overall it seems good.
Here\'s a pic just cuz I\'m feeling somewhat accomplished, although it really looks no different than when I started. Glad to have my Jeep back!!!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on January 23, 2011, 09:53:48 PM
maybe whispering pines next weekend?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 23, 2011, 10:29:59 PM
Absolutely. I\'m dying to go wheeling. I\'d like it to get a good thrashing once to make sure everything\'s alright before I make the trek to Rausch.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on January 24, 2011, 07:28:52 AM
:chug:
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on January 25, 2011, 07:23:52 PM
Gotta work all weekend. :angry::angry::angry:
One of my rear shocks is dented and bottoms out rather abruptly on decent bumps. Got two ordered and was gonna put them on Friday night for WP... Oh well.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on February 09, 2011, 08:33:44 PM
Turns out my shocks have been bottoming out because the mounts on my 8.8 are too high. As soon as I fab up some new mounts to attach lower, I\'ll be ready for the trails.
The next project I\'d like to tackle is on board air using the AC compressor. I\'d like to be able to air down whenever and wherever. I\'ve compiled a parts list and I don\'t think it should be too hard or expensive. I plan to use the passenger\'s side rocker tube as a tank to save interior space.
I found that S & W cages makes a pre-bent XJ kit for $300. I would like to do this and unibody stiffeners and tie them together when I rip out my interior to fix and Rhino Line my floor.
I also read an article about an on-board welder kit you can buy in Petersen\'s. Thought it was pretty awesome, did some research and found it wouldn\'t be too hard or expensive to make my own, that\'s on the list too.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on February 20, 2011, 09:20:36 PM
Went to Whispering Pines today. Beautiful day and beautiful conditions. First time out without open diffs and it was amazing. It was incredible to feel it pull up all the hill climbs and through all the drifts I know it never would have before.
At one point I broke ice going through a water hole. My buddy in his YJ attempted it and got stuck. I tried to free him, only to dig 4 nice ruts for myself. He winched me back off them so I could get some momentum and drive back over them. I got a little over zealous with the momentum. After front driveshaft removal, 2wd journey back to the road, and a AAA call, my Jeep is back in Rochester with one mangled upper control arm and one mangled upper control arm mount and waaaayy too much castor.
I figure I can either build a long-arm setup now, or get some beefy upper control arms. I also haven\'t ruled out an aftermarket long arm upgrade kit, especially a quality used one. I want to build a long arm, but also wanna get back to wheeling since I just got it back together!
Mulling over all my options.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on February 20, 2011, 09:34:07 PM
oops! fragile control arms and mounts suck!!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on February 21, 2011, 08:31:11 AM
ive done oba and welder setups before, its not too bad.
recomend the big york over converting an AC pump. it can be done though.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on February 21, 2011, 11:06:57 AM
I\'ve done some research and I think I have a plan. I really liked my drop brackets because they flexed and rode great, but they gave awful ground clearance. Raising the mounting points on the axle does the same thing and improves clearance.
Clayton makes an entire new axle bracket kit that does that for $469. They sell just the upper control arm mount part for $155, which includes the Johnny Joints that press in. I\'ll need to weld on raised lower arm mounts and fab new upper arms, no big deal.
So for about $200, I\'ll get improved ride, flex, and ground clearance and most importantly bulletproof mounts that will make a great mounting point for a long arm in the future.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on February 21, 2011, 11:40:58 AM
Stock axle-side LCA mounts are notoriously weak, especially when subjected to the bashing they get in the rocks. Good place to upgrade!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on February 21, 2011, 12:24:53 PM
I figured it was only a matter of time before I bent or ripped off the LCA mounts as well. I like this plan because it addresses the upper AND lower mounts.
I did a little more research and found that Ballistic makes a raw truss for $83. Scratch the Clayton kit, get two UCA Ballistic joints and I\'m at the same price. A little more head scratching and fab work to get the UCA joints located right, but I\'ll have a truss.
I\'m off work today preparing for a colonoscopy tomorrow, so I have lots of research time. :)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 17, 2011, 07:39:47 PM
Truss will be here Monday. Anyone have any advice on not warping the crap out of my tubes? Was considering welding some pedestals to the bench and then welding the axle on them. I\'m gonna TIG it, LOTS of tacks and then small welds and let cool.
Also, should I be worried about frying the pinion seal when preheating the housing? I don\'t plan to get it glowing red or anything. I do plan to replace the axle seals.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on March 18, 2011, 01:05:37 PM
weld \'er up! what could possibly go wrong :hammer:
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 27, 2011, 08:37:29 PM
To be honest, I should probably adopt that mindset a little more Mindless.
Got a bunch done this weekend. Between the parts and the 6hrs I have into them, I probably didn\'t save much making the arms but they were fun. I\'m hoping they will work on some radius arms in the future. Gotta finish welding up the mounts and a couple other things and put it all back together.
Sure hope I make it more than one outing before it\'s back in the shop again!!!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: jACeL86 on March 28, 2011, 06:16:12 AM
Hahahahaha... you really DID mangle those stock arms and mounts did\'nt ya! Kudos on the new stuff, coming along nicely.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on March 28, 2011, 07:44:14 AM
Quote
jACeL86 wrote: Hahahahaha... you really DID mangle those stock arms and mounts did\'nt ya!
No kidding! wow.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on March 28, 2011, 08:10:53 AM
looks good, id like the see a little more steel spread out on those mounts to the truss though in my opinion.
lets go wheeling!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 28, 2011, 12:47:18 PM
Quote
smichaelR22 wrote: looks good, id like the see a little more steel spread out on those mounts to the truss though in my opinion.
Do you mean as far is it not spreading all the way end to end? I plan to cut out some pieces of either 1/4 or 1/2 to kinda bridge that gap. I\'m gusseting the inner Cs as well so I\'d like to tie them into it all.
Quote
smichaelR22 wrote: lets go wheeling!
!!!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on March 28, 2011, 01:58:41 PM
I\'m pretty sure he means off the sides of the tabs, to the truss. Me too.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on March 29, 2011, 11:05:55 AM
ya, i think i see a single 1/2\" thick mount holding a bushing sleve up right? that puts a lot on your welds. would be much stronger with like a piece of 1/4\" wall box like 2\"x2\" or something like that.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 29, 2011, 08:39:34 PM
Oh yes, those will be gusseted for sure. I had them welded on and they failed the test fit. Trying again tomorrow.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on April 06, 2011, 07:08:51 PM
Tryin hard to be done for this weekend!!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on April 11, 2011, 08:54:18 PM
So how much would 34s and 3.55s suck?
34s for sale (http://www.rc4x4.org/rcforum/index.php/topic,13538.0.html)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: carchameleon on April 12, 2011, 06:51:49 AM
3.07\'s and 33\'s wasn\'t so bad
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on April 12, 2011, 07:38:33 AM
the wonder has 3.07 and 35\"s it kinda sucks but works with a 4 speed. i say 4 speed because you dont event use 5th gear on the thruway at 75.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on April 12, 2011, 07:38:43 AM
the wonder has 3.07 and 35\"s it kinda sucks but works with a 4 speed. i say 4 speed because you dont event use 5th gear on the thruway at 75.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: carchameleon on April 12, 2011, 07:54:11 PM
actually, my cj is 3.55\'s and 35\'s & i have no problems it is a 4 speed though :-)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 23, 2011, 04:20:57 PM
Talked with Smike a little yesterday about my brakes. They kinda suck. Didn\'t get as much improvement from the rear discs as I\'d hoped. What do any other 8.8 swappers suggest for this? Swap proportioning valves from a ZJ with rear discs? Bigger master cylinder?
I showed Smike this and he said it was too much work. I kinda agree I guess but thought it was interesting... http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1062525 Both my unit bearings are hosed. So this would get me slightly larger rotors (I think), bigger calipers, and real hub bearings. I\'m gonna have to spend $300 on unit bearings anyway... Thoughts?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on May 23, 2011, 04:45:34 PM
Love it.
you\'re stuck with 5 on 5.5\" though.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 23, 2011, 05:07:11 PM
Yeah, I\'m hoping I could pick up some cheap steelies in the right bolt pattern, and there\'s no getting around the $100 wheel adapters for the rear. 8.8 is a little narrow anyway.
Got any parts laying around, Mike?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: luvmyxj on May 23, 2011, 09:34:03 PM
another trick is pulling its either a spring or a pin out of the front of the xj prop valve been a while sice i seen the write up
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on May 24, 2011, 12:30:58 PM
I only have 8 lug stuff laying around.
Everything you\'d need except calipers, off a Ford D44HD, but that\'s a little big I think :)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 24, 2011, 01:45:14 PM
New to all this, I\'m assuming that there is more to 1/2 and 3/4 ton that just the extra 3 wheel studs... As in, your stuff wouldn\'t work with 5 stud drive flanges or whatever right?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on May 24, 2011, 02:06:17 PM
I think the spindles are the same, but brake brackets and hubs and lockouts are all wrong
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 27, 2011, 11:25:00 AM
So when I said my unit bearings were hosed, I didn\'t realize just how bad they were... Bad. To the point that there was no way my pads were pushing squarely on my rotor. Replaced them with some Timkens and put new pads on for the sake of simplicity and wheeling this weekend.
Braking is much better now, although my pedal is still very squishy. Been this way a while, I don\'t think it\'s a bleeding issue. Anyone know anything about upgrading master cylinder bore? Stock XJ according to NAPA is 1.0625, and stock Durango (which is a bolt in according to NAXJA) is 1.125. Might try that.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on May 27, 2011, 11:30:49 AM
i have two unit bearings you could have \"borrowed\" dont forget a call to Arie is worth your time for any parts.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 27, 2011, 11:45:49 AM
Didn\'t even think about that. Just wanted it done before it rained.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 28, 2011, 05:18:24 PM
Today at WP as some of you know I spit out one of my u-joint caps. I\'ll be sourcing some new shafts shortly, and taking Keith\'s advice to put a tack on each new cap to keep them in place.
Mike and I also found that my pinion yoke had a bit of play up and down. I have no idea how long it\'s been like this. Before I talk myself into thinking that 4.88s are the only way to fix this, is it likely that I have done much damage to the gears themselves? Is there any chance I can pull the pinion preload back into spec by tightening that big nut?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on May 28, 2011, 05:59:28 PM
There is a crush sleeve in there. If you tighten it, you may exceed your tolerances. Can\'t see why it would hurt to snug it up to see if that addresses your issue...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 28, 2011, 08:59:35 PM
Found many threads on many different forums where people discussed pinion bearing replacement without gear setup. Hoping to just do that I guess.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on May 31, 2011, 08:25:10 AM
I still say just tighten it up especially if you\'re thinking 4.88s at some point (I\'d suggest 4.56s though for strength issues, or name brand high quality 4.88s....)
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on May 31, 2011, 10:23:02 AM
dont put 4.88\'s in
that will be your new weak link. Ryan ran good gears, i ran Italian Gears. We both broke teeth off very quickly.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 31, 2011, 03:42:56 PM
Duly noted. 4.56 it is then. Still hoping to get away with running it the way it is for a while.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 05, 2011, 03:52:08 PM
Borrowed a 3/4\" drive socket set and 24\" crescent wrench to tighten up the pinion nut. Put many cranks on the nut with basically no improvement in the amount of play in the yoke. Ended up stripping the pinion nut threads. I think the threads on the pinion are OK, and I read that that is a deforming nut?
So now I need advice on my next course of action...
Put a new nut on and try again? Seems harmless but probably pointless. I\'m guessing the play was in the bearings and no amount of tightening would fix it. I ordered two nuts so I can at least try I guess?
Replace the pinion bearings? Can this actually be done without concern for shimming and whatnot? I read that measuring the shim set that comes out and using the same thickness would put me close enough. Seems a little sketchy.
Or do I go 4.56? I can swing it financially but I\'m not really dieing with 3.55s I have. It looks like I can get G2 (quality?) 4.56 for D30/8.8 with master install kits from 4WP on sale for under $500 shipped... I have a 3.73 D30 carrier a friend gave me but I\'d still have to get new shafts and carrier for the 8.8 since everything is welded together.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on June 06, 2011, 10:15:40 AM
should be able to replace the bearings with out messing with gear setup. no crush sleeve right? If the backlash is way off after the new install, then i might run a pattern to see where you are. Timkins tolerances are VERY tight.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 06, 2011, 10:31:38 AM
All factory D30s should have a crush sleeve. There are eliminator kits, and if it could not be tightened further I\'d expect this has got to have one. Or Ryan, Myself and Keith were all thinking wrong when we discussed 30 crush sleeves at lunch yesterday.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on June 06, 2011, 11:27:19 AM
wrong.
my CJ did not have a crush sleeve in the front30.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 06, 2011, 03:18:43 PM
I thought I read that all HP D30s were shimmed and no crush sleeves? Anyway, I\'ve decided to just go the repair route for the sake of minimizing downtime. Got a few little things to tend to but I plan to make it to Rausch this month.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 07, 2011, 08:01:39 PM
What are the big shim looking things that I messed up? I ordered inner/outer bearings and races, shims, seal, and a nut. Did I miss something?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 08, 2011, 08:43:20 AM
oil slingers.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 08, 2011, 03:59:29 PM
I\'m having trouble finding them... Anyone got one laying around? I read the front one can be thrown out if you account for it\'s thickness in shims? Bad idea? I think I can reuse the outer one I have.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 08, 2011, 04:18:10 PM
It helps keep oil in the pinion bearing... I\'d not throw it out myself but that is true. I have no 30 stuff and I\'m no help on finding one.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 14, 2011, 08:46:39 PM
Ready to bolt up and wheel right??? The pattern checker stuff I got from Napa seemed a little goopy compared to the pics I\'m used to looking at... Can anyone tell anything by looking at the pics? I think I need to loosen the preload a little but I wanted to make sure everything seated. The backlash seems a little tight too, I\'ll check that tomorrow.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on June 15, 2011, 08:23:34 AM
the front one i have doesnt have the offset like you have.
i threw both of mine out on the 30\'s i have done cause the were hosed also.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 15, 2011, 02:59:45 PM
coast side looks good, drive side looks mildly terrible but it\'s REALLY hard to tell with that stuff. The yellow shows MUCH better.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 15, 2011, 06:29:00 PM
Where do I get the yellow stuff? Backlash is .003\"... I feel like my pinion depth is too much, but there were no pinion depth shims! Just the baffle which I destroyed and replaced. I didn\'t check the thickness of the old vs new but am really wishing I had. The baffle I got was a Dana/Spicer part, I figured it would be the same. I have no idea what else would cause the problem.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 15, 2011, 07:07:40 PM
These are a little better of the drive side.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 15, 2011, 09:37:59 PM
I\'d agree that the pinion looks too deep. second pics look much better. I think it\'s something I\'d run.
your backlash was probably a little looser before allowing for the shallower effective pinion depth. best guess?
the yellow gear marking compound has a Chevy part number that The Google probably knows. I may have a little leftover in with my setup bearings but I\'ve only gotten it with install kits.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 16, 2011, 05:02:21 AM
I was thinking the pinion being in too far was causing the the less than ideal pattern and low backlash. I was considering pulling out the inner race and trying to find a thinner baffle. Read the dealer has two baffles of different thicknesses. Worth it?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 16, 2011, 11:41:51 AM
if you\'re not tired of it and ready to say \"F THIS IMA GUNNA RUN IT\" it may be worth it....
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 16, 2011, 02:59:28 PM
I am totally at that point. I will check the lead time on one from the dealer and go from there. If it\'s not gonna happen before the weekend... that will be my F IT point.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 19, 2011, 09:18:53 PM
I\'m having trouble finding anything on the baffle. Which would be worse? Putting in the correct thickness of shims with no baffle to get the pattern right or having the baffle with a bad pattern?
If I put it together as is will it grenade and lock up my front tires while I\'m doing 70 on the way to Rausch? I have no CAD or lockout hubs so they\'ll be whirlin around the whole time...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 19, 2011, 09:50:02 PM
right pattern is definitely better.... just overfill it some.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 20, 2011, 08:58:13 PM
Got two different brand baffles coming in tomorrow, we\'ll see how they mic out. Just so I have an idea, about how much shimmage am I looking to remove?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 21, 2011, 04:04:07 PM
At this point I kinda doubt anyone is reading about my boring gear setup anyway, but I made a few adjustments after ditching the baffle using only shims and ended up with a decent pattern. Backlash is up to .0075\" which is still in spec. Gonna go finish bolting everything else up now, should be Rausch Ready!!!
Thanks Mindless for being my gear setup mentor.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 21, 2011, 09:37:57 PM
I still hate your marking compound (!), but that looks like a for-real good pattern at last. Pretty typical for used gears to end up deep on coast shallow on drive. If you could tighten backlash just a sneeze that might improve - or it might not. I\'d be happy with what you\'ve got there. Since you don\'t have that baffle, just be sure you\'ve got it as full as you can get it so you don\'t starve the pinion bearings on the highway.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 21, 2011, 10:01:03 PM
I know, the prusian blue was a fail. It was the one thing I never thought of until I was about to put it on. I drove it for 30-40min and it didn\'t blow up so hopefully I\'m in the clear.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on June 22, 2011, 07:48:36 AM
ha! good field test!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 27, 2011, 09:19:35 PM
Won\'t go any lower than $300. I know someone who can pick them up for me. Good deal? I\'ll have to find less backspaced wheels but can probably recoup that selling my current setup.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on June 27, 2011, 10:19:02 PM
Those look pretty beat for $300 to my eyes. Looks like 40-50% from the pictures.
I\'d say \"passable deal,\" not \"good deal.\"
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on June 28, 2011, 06:47:29 AM
Run your 32s until you are ready for 35s. One inch isn\'t much to get excited over...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 28, 2011, 09:44:04 PM
Given my \"strategically aggressive\" driving style, do you think I can make my D30 last on 35s? Mike and I were leaning towards no. I don\'t want to dump a bunch of money into it as I see bigger things than 35s down the road. I also think I can get away without gears on 33\'s, but strength is really my biggest concern.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on June 29, 2011, 06:22:27 PM
You haven\'t even broken it once yet, have you? Break it a couple of times first, then look to upgrade. Your driving style might not be as aggressive as you think... yet.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on July 02, 2011, 03:24:13 PM
Haven\'t broken anything mechanical, although I seem to have a knack for mangling suspension parts. Debating fixing it, making new ones, or taking the plunge on building frame stiffeners and long arms. The latter two don\'t bode well for my plan to save for tires and gears, but oh well. They are both good things to have down the road. Although, Mark seems to be a good example of big tires working well on short arms...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on July 04, 2011, 04:11:25 PM
short arms become more of an issue with more lift - it\'s all about the steep angles.
Also, it\'s more a handling issue than anything. Crawling it\'s not as noticeable as it is at high speeds or on the road. The one time it\'ll hurt you is ledges and undercuts, since the obstacle will have more leverage pushing back against the tires, which is in the arc of downtravel. Tough to explain but if you think about the arc of motion of the axle with short versus long arms you\'ll \"get it\" quickly I\'m sure.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on July 04, 2011, 05:50:22 PM
Yep, I gotcha. That was the biggest reason I raised all my axle bracketry. The arm mounted about 2.5\" or 3\" lower than it does in that picture, made a big difference in handling and ride quality. For now, I think I will just cut the bushings and joints off and weld them to some heavier tubing.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on July 05, 2011, 02:50:26 PM
Upper pass side link mount where it welds to the truss. Cut it off and 3 link to the driver\'s side? :banghead:
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on July 05, 2011, 03:22:17 PM
driver side looks a whole lot beefier, I still think they deserve a little more BEEF.
Going to a 3 link from a 4 link you REALLY decrease the forces on the links and mounts though, since they aren\'t fighting each other to articulate.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on July 05, 2011, 08:12:31 PM
Just spent about 4hrs researching XJ 3 links on Pirate. At one point or another I read about how every idea I had was a no-no on a 3 link. The ones that really stick out are:
Using bushings Using 2\" Johnny Joints Using 7/16\" [GR8 of course] hardware
These were my ideas mostly because they involve reusing parts I bought not so long ago. Considering just repairing what I have before I hastily rebuild my front suspension. However, I really like the idea of reducing bind with the 3 link as I have a feeling that contributed to the crack in the truss. Seasoned suspension builders, please enlighten me.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on July 05, 2011, 08:24:56 PM
Quote
xjh3 wrote: I really like the idea of reducing bind with the 3 link as I have a feeling that contributed to the crack in the truss.
IMO that sums it up right there.
7/16 hardware seems awful small to me but I\'m sure \"it\'ll be fine?\" Bushings are great, they reduce pounding on joints and mounts. I plan to always run bushings on the axle end going forward. I have them at the frame end now because that made sense at the time (many many moons ago)....
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on July 09, 2011, 12:21:59 PM
Ruff Stuff heims on the way. Planning to build a new upper link that will use 5/8\" hardware vs the current 7/16\". Cut off the pass side link tower, build a beefed mount for the driver\'s side atop the truss, and beef the upper arm frame mount. Not my original plan, but I don\'t think I can afford the downtime for much more right now.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on July 17, 2011, 04:17:04 PM
Made some progress this weekend. Got as far as a test fit with a test upper link. Gotta pull the frame side mount off and finish welding the plate on, I foolishly thought I could pull it off with fluxcore. I kinda eye balled the angle on it when I tacked it on but it will obviously be straight for finish welding. Brought lots of extra plate home to slice up for gussets.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on November 05, 2011, 08:39:58 PM
Well I am in CT, got my Junk here via Burb and Uhaul trailer, got some rental garage space and finally got working! I ditched the plans in my previous post and went with the a mid-arm 3 link as opposed to just one upper with short lowers. Left to do is reinforcing the upper axle mount, welding up the links, some more frame plating, and paint. Eventually I will get longer shocks, brake lines and coils.
Got some 33\" TSLs with good tread for $100, too.
Can\'t wait to get to Rausch! Hoping I can make it to an open FL4x4 trip!
Edit: Must be non-members can\'t post pics?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on November 06, 2011, 08:39:50 AM
I was just reading through your thread yesterday. You\'ve done a ton of work!
Get busy. There\'s a trip this coming weekend!
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on November 06, 2011, 04:33:42 PM
I have done a ton of work. I\'d like to start wheeling more in return.
I saw you guys were going down this coming weekend... I would LOVE to go! I have a reasonable amount left that I could have it done in time, but the Burb also needs brakes and I don\'t think it would be a good decision financially at this point. Still catching up from moving.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on November 14, 2011, 07:06:18 PM
Test drive was a success. Anybody wanna do a winter Rausch run???
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on December 02, 2011, 04:13:33 PM
i have a 94 4 door being parted out you xj guys need anything?
its white
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 02, 2011, 04:28:09 PM
I think the chain in my 231 is stretched. How many miles? Also, have a couple people that may be interested in swapping a HP 30 for their LP. I will think but I\'m sure there is stuff I could use. Will be home around Christmas again.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on December 02, 2011, 10:58:31 PM
120k on this one, not sure the case will be available, but deff the front HP non disco axle is available.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Callelle on December 02, 2011, 11:06:53 PM
How about an engine or gas tank skid?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on December 04, 2011, 04:31:55 PM
motor is gone, i can check on the skid
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 04, 2011, 05:41:51 PM
Callelle, if you are having trouble finding a gas tank skid, ZJ skids fit but don\'t have holes in the right spot. That\'s what mine is, redrilled the holes and fit great. May want to consider beefing it a litte, mine is a little mangled.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on December 04, 2011, 05:53:54 PM
And just to keep things slightly on topic, here is an updated pic with my new $160 tire/wheel combo.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 20, 2012, 07:57:46 AM
Haven't added to this in a while and haven't really started another build thread elsewhere, so just an update.
The three link did awesome at Rausch in January. I'm very pleased with it! Right now my shocks are limiting my travel. Might be getting a hold of Ryan about some 12" travel Profenders to get rid of my 10" Skycrappers. I have longer SS braided brake lines for it when I do this as well. Will probably do some front unibody stiffening, brake lines, and shocks all in one shot.
Rear shocks are super short and limiting flex. Not much room on an XJ so the mounts either have to go down on the axle (not happening) or up through the floor. That's in the planning phase as well. This will probably be accompanied by more uinbody stiffening.
I have decided to not spend ANY more money on these axles other than junkyard parts to keep me wheeling. They're fine axles, but I see the writing on the wall and tons are in the future.
So, in the quest for more gearing, I have started to look at doublers. If I buy this kit: http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=696803 I can use my current 231 as the donor. If I use a flipped D300 transfercase behind it, it already has fixed yokes and is shorter than a 231 and people report not needing to change driveshaft lengths. Right now I have matching shafts f/r which is pretty awesome.
This seems like something I will almost surely need running tons and 38" or larger tires with my 4.0 (which I have no plans of losing.) What do you guys think? Good time to upgrade? Or am I just going to blow up my axles?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Callelle on March 20, 2012, 08:30:44 AM
Assuming you have the 8.25 29 spline, you'd probobly be better off upgrading to new axles if you wanna run 38s. the 8.25 can handle 35s pretty well with upgraded shafts, but anything beyond that, you'd just be running on borrowed time. If it were my XJ and my money, I'd just go ahead and throw tons under it rather than waiting for the small axles to explode.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 20, 2012, 08:40:25 AM
Nooo I wouldn't dream of running 38's on stock axles! I've got a HP30 and 8.8 right now with 3.55s. I'm weary of going much larger than 33's with this setup. My thought was to spend the money upgrading to a doubler now to get some gearing back in the rocks. It would also be an upgrade that will be very beneficial when it does get tons and big tires.
I guess I should clarify... With my Jeep as it sits with 33"s/3.55s, am I going to blow stuff up with a doubler? Or should I just wait till it's actually on tons and stuff? I like the idea of putting money into parts that will complement future parts...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: rejeep on March 20, 2012, 08:42:49 AM
your 8.8 will be fine with just about anything...
your D30 will be fine as well..
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Callelle on March 20, 2012, 08:55:58 AM
guess I should have gone back and read a little bit >.<
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 20, 2012, 09:07:05 AM
231/300 ought to be a nice setup. It will help you not break things more than break things in most cases IMO because you can be gentler.
X2 less skinny and more finesse
I rarely hit the gas when crawling... just idle over things.. I would have done a doubler if I had some more wheen base... but my 8.8 pinion is already pointed to the sky
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Callelle on March 20, 2012, 09:44:24 AM
guess I should have gone back and read a little bit >.<
No worries! You're Jeep is coming along nicely! Maybe you'll do a better job than me at keeping the body straight.
Thanks ^_^. It's coming along slowly but surely. Gonna try and keep the body fairly straight, but crunkles are gonna happen. Chicks dig battle scars, right?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 20, 2012, 10:05:17 AM
Kind of what I was thinking. I do like to use the throttle, but I wouldn't say liberally. And if I get into a situation where crawling isn't working and I need a little momentum/wheelspeed, I could take the 231 out and have a normal low for that.
Arie... If you go the D300 route with the kit I posted, the drivetrain length stays within 1/4" of the original length I'm reading. And the D300 already has a fixed rear yoke. Food for thought...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: gCracker on March 20, 2012, 10:24:26 AM
I almost went the 231/300 way but then fell into a Rubi-241 so that is going in soon.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: rejeep on March 20, 2012, 10:36:31 AM
I looked at it 100 different ways.. it won’t be pretty.. Have a 4:1 case already… if I ever wanted more I would be looking into an atlas.
I learned a long time ago that the equipment you run is only as good as the seat time you have… My proportion has been out of whack lately..
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Wingman on March 20, 2012, 11:29:04 AM
Guy still has this... Thinking he'd move on the price since it's been up since December. I'm afraid I'd have to use his driveshafts though, and I would probably want to flip the 231 so I could use a double cardan in the front. I'm going to gather more info.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: rejeep on March 20, 2012, 08:39:03 PM
bob own an off road shop.. he knows what he has and a quick sale doesnt mean anything..
if your serious and have cash in hand i can call him for you and make the arrangements
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on March 20, 2012, 08:54:55 PM
bob own an off road shop.. he knows what he has and a quick sale doesnt mean anything..
if your serious and have cash in hand i can call him for you and make the arrangements
I was hoping I could get him to let go of just the doubler for $500, cash in hand of course. I'm now debating whether it's worth it because my front driveshaft won't be long enough. Not so sure of that now based on your comment. Haha
Do you think it's worth it to just buy the shafts too? I'm worried about getting them home and finding they don't fit. I'd rather spend the money on a new shaft that fits rather than old ones that might not. Rear is fine though.
Title: XJ Build
Post by: etk300ex on March 21, 2012, 11:12:57 AM
Nooo I wouldn't dream of running 38's on stock axles!
What's wrong with that ;)
Your truck came stock with a solid front axle? ;D
Doubler is mine. Arie, Bob is a cool guy.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: etk300ex on March 26, 2012, 07:11:04 AM
well it just moved up a few years ;D
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on April 02, 2012, 01:02:14 PM
Another solid weekend at Rausch. Maybe if I wheel with you guys this summer and get a refresher on what 40s can do I'll change my mind but I can't lie... I'm not excited about tearing this thing apart for tons anytime soon.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on May 03, 2012, 09:21:47 AM
Thinking about these if I can get him down on price. He still has them, but I'm afraid that may indicate stubborness on his part. I've seen builds where the pass side get's narrowed 4" or so which pulls the pumpkin over making the coil bucket land in the the perfect spot. Sterling rears are offset 2-3" so narrowing the set wouldn't put me out more than the fab time, sourcing another short side 10.25 shaft from the junkyard, and either a custom or shortened and re-splined long pass side 60 shaft.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 20, 2012, 07:20:01 PM
Title: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on May 20, 2012, 07:31:04 PM
Not too stubborn, eh?
Can't shorten stock shafts, they neck down. Gotta go bling.
Title: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 20, 2012, 08:16:57 PM
No actually that guy never responded. Front is 4.10 rear is c&c 14 bolt so it's already like 63" wms width. Gonna shoot for
Title: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 20, 2012, 08:20:24 PM
65" wide for the front. D60 was $300 delivered to my house. Fresh out of a running truck with new u joints and ball joints. Weston (85jimmyguy) picked up a spare set of Chevy tons for a stupid price and the rear turned out to be exactly what I needed. So I'm getting that for the "what's a 14 bolt between friends?" price hahaha
Title: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on May 20, 2012, 08:23:01 PM
Are you referring to the 60 shafts necking down I'm assuming? Oh well. One custom shaft I'll pry never break anyway isn't that bad.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: 85jimmyguy on May 25, 2012, 01:44:54 PM
look at those things! PS.. we are going to try and shove that 14 bolt into you focus this weekend so you can take it home with you.... just thought i'd let you know... ;D
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on June 10, 2012, 09:11:50 PM
Will that hook come off? Or is it on there permanently?
Haha didn't really try yet but I'll get it off. It will be returned from which it came with a new strap to take the place of the many times divided one I borowed. ;D
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on September 14, 2012, 07:22:25 AM
Anyone have any opinions on these? My Ruff Stuff heims are shot and these are not a whole lot more expensive. More importantly... They're rebuildable.
I'm not a fan of the idea of having to buy $260 worth of heims once a year and just live with the fact that I can't drive my Jeep down the road by the end of the season because they're all worn out. Putting another turn on the retaining ring to milk them along or just spending $33 on the rebuild kit instead seems appealing. Researching how much life people are getting out of them now.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on September 14, 2012, 09:39:44 AM
didn't I just see within a day or two that Ballistic is bankrupt?
rebuildable joints all seem to manage to fall apart somehow. I'm a beiliever in a quality heim joint.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on September 14, 2012, 09:54:33 AM
That was a while ago. They're under new management now.
I agree too, but if Ruff Stuffs aren't lasting, now what? QA1? Or is this just all I'm going to get out of them? I'd almost rather go back to some sort of flex joint I can rebuild for $10/joint and do that twice a season than keep buying new heims once a season.
>:(
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on September 14, 2012, 10:22:23 AM
QA-1 are the best I've run. Avoid Aurora.
Title: XJ Build
Post by: etk300ex on September 14, 2012, 11:26:16 AM
Leaf springs ftw :D
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: Spencer on September 14, 2012, 06:05:13 PM
buy them so i know if i should too
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on September 17, 2012, 06:57:08 AM
Johnny Joints are $40/piece and cost $10 to rebuild. From what I've read, there seems to be a difference between the 'real deal' Johnny Joints and every other cartridge type joint (especially Ballistic.) A set of four is about the same cost as a set of two heims, so I'm going to rock them for a season and if they suck, I will rebuild them and sell them.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on September 17, 2012, 08:23:06 AM
what size heims are you using? racing doesnt seem to bother the 1.25" that i run?
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on September 17, 2012, 09:15:17 AM
Ruff Stuff 1.25"...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on September 17, 2012, 10:37:11 AM
its got to be a geometry thing or something. other than some WD for race prep, its been more than a season on the rear end, and almost a season on the front of 571. They see a ton more abuse that could possibly happen on your XJ....
interesting.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on September 17, 2012, 11:00:45 AM
I thought you were replacing them once a season Smike. Figured it was still a lot for my XJ to be wearing them out as often as 571 though! They're not ALL spanked, but one is really loose and another has a little play. I have misalignment spacers on them and their is pretty much no misalignment at ride height.
7/8s heims on the upper are still minty fresh... Possibly the direct rock contact the lowers see is part of the issue?
Title: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on September 17, 2012, 11:01:39 AM
Unless its road salt getting through the hard chrome plating, rusting the ball, then wearing on the liner? Only thing I can think an XJ could do harder than a u4 buggy
Title: XJ Build
Post by: MrMindless on September 17, 2012, 11:02:59 AM
571's lower arms may have seen direct rock contact once or twice.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on September 17, 2012, 11:20:56 AM
Ok, wasn't sure if the body of the heim was completely exposed on 571 like mine are. These basically have seen no salt, I can see a tiny reflection of myself when I look at them. Haha. It is definitely the lining wearing out.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on September 17, 2012, 11:51:03 AM
they get rapped pretty good on the buggy. i do have bushings on one end that i replace often. 3/4 heims on the steering didnt last, the 7/8" last longer but after 150 race miles they are starting to loosen up.
all the 1.25" heims i have on the buggy are original. i did the front first, then the rear.
in my opinion, all ballistic / jonny joint / ball end things / bushings are junk compared to the ruff stuff 1.25 heims.
things made for street jeeps are not made for flogging.
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: xjh3 on September 18, 2012, 07:52:10 AM
i do have bushings on one end that i replace often.
I was thinking, I wonder if this is the key. On the hard hits, you've got some poly to soak up the impact. I've got heims on both ends. That energy has to go somewhere...
Title: Re: XJ Build
Post by: smichaelR22 on September 18, 2012, 08:15:31 AM
i guess ill let you know when i build the new buggy, it will be hard heimd all over.
Title: XJ Build
Post by: Spencer on October 03, 2012, 10:48:58 AM
I love the new paint!
Title: XJ Build
Post by: Spencer on October 03, 2012, 10:57:55 AM
